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Great Awokening, 6

Williams Political Science Professor Darel Paul writes about “Listening at the Great Awokening.” This is a brilliant article, worth reading in full. Relevant controversies at Williams include The Taco Six, Self-CARE Now, UL/Derbyshire, Green/Love Black Joy, and White Male Vigilantes. Alas, I don’t fully trust our busy readership to find the time to do so! So, we will spend two weeks going through the entire article. Day 6.

Speaking with anti-racists and engaging terms such as racism and violence involves entering an interpretative thicket. When the boundaries of racism expand to include the statements Make America Great Again (Skidmore College) and It’s OK to be white (Bates College, the latest of dozens of examples of this form of trolling) and the dictates of cultural appropriation forbid white people from teaching yoga (University of Ottawa) and performing Indian dance (American University), one despairs of ever extricating oneself from the entanglements of meaning.

Indeed. Again, if I wanted to make trouble at Williams, I would first put up a bunch of posters “It’s OK to be black.” Nothing bad would happen! Then, in the same locations, I would put up posters “It’s OK to be white.” Williams would melt down, as Northwestern has under former Williams President Morty Schapiro’s leadership.

Also, recall the saga of The Taco Six.

Sadly, I don’t know nearly as many of the details of the Taco Six (fall 2014) as I should. (See here for excellent discussion and debate.) I think that the students were never “punished” by the College except to the extent that they were threatened/tortured by the Dean’s Office. (In many of these cases, the process itself is the punishment.)

Woke culture came to Williams before the Fall of 2014, but the Taco Six is still one of its earliest and clearest manifestations.

More from Paul below:

Hate crimes, one hopes, are the most likely site of broad agreement. In 2016, the US Department of Education reported 458 on-campus or residence hall hate crimes on the basis of race among some 12.8 million students at the country’s 4945 public and private non-profit, four-year degree-granting college and university campuses. 95% of these campuses reported no racially motivated hate crimes at all, which suggests that claims of widespread racial violence have been considerably exaggerated. Just 1% of campuses reported racially motivated hate crimes involving physical harm against persons or property—larceny, assault, burglary, robbery, etc. The remaining 4% reported only acts of destruction/damage/vandalism (e.g. graffiti exhibiting bias) and/or intimidation (e.g. threatening posters or speech). Even if we include intimidation in the category of physical harm, just 3% of campuses had even one such incident in 2016. Consider further that, according to political scientist Wilfred Reilly, 15–50% of all hate crimes in the United States are hoaxes or false reports, with campus hate crimes at the higher end of that range. Thus, even the 3% of four-year degree campuses reporting even one racially motivated violent hate crime is almost surely an overestimate. This is not to say that the 400 genuine racial hate crimes each year are irrelevant or simply the price black students, in particular, must pay to be educated. However, such rare and almost always anonymous occurrences, vigorously investigated by campus authorities, cannot stand as evidence of an institutional culture of anti-blackness.

To anti-racist activists, however, reported hate crimes are only the visible tip of the racial violence iceberg. Beneath officially reported hate crimes are the more pervasive bias incidents. In 2016, over 230 US colleges and universities operated bias reporting systems. While few maintain much transparency, the University of Michigan–Ann Arbor publishes a bias incident report log online. In July–December 2017 alone, 60 racial bias incidents involving students were reported on campus or online. During all of 2017, the campus reported just three racially-motivated hate crimes to the Department of Education. This is clearly a tremendous difference. Unfortunately, the University of Michigan’s relatively open reporting system gives little if any information on the content of biased speech or action and usually no information at all on the race of bias targets. Prior to being sued in 2018 for violating students’ free speech rights, the university’s Bias Response Team claimed “the most important indication of bias is your own feelings,” making agreement on the definition of bias likely impossible. Thus, even from this rich data source, it is difficult to draw any reliable conclusions. Interestingly, a 2016 campus climate survey conducted by the university found that self-reported discrimination on the basis of political orientation was more prevalent than on the basis of either race or sex. The university does not even collect incident data on experiences of political bias.

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30 Comments To "Great Awokening, 6"

#1 Comment By abl On June 10, 2019 @ 10:10 am

Torture, David? Really?

In any event, I’m a little confused here: do you not see the problem with dressing up as an exaggerated negative-stereotype-reinforcing caricature of Mexican people? The implication of your post seems to be that these sorts of ‘controversies’ are unwarranted–that, presumably, Williams should be entirely blasé about such incidents.

I suspect that there’s some point at which you and I disagree regarding whether something was offensive or problematic (or, at a minimum, an opportunity for a teachable moment). I’m trying to get a better sense of where that disagreement lies.

#2 Comment By David Dudley Field ’25 On June 10, 2019 @ 10:23 am

> an exaggerated negative-stereotype-reinforcing caricature

1) Are mustaches negative?

2) Are sombreros negative?

Or perhaps mustaches are OK and sombreros are OK, but only a racist would put them together?

By the way, here are the images that Google pulls up for “girls mexican costumes”. I am sure that all PC Williams students would appreciate it Dean Sandstrom could go through them all and let them know which ones are acceptable at a Williams party and which ones are not. How about these two from Halloween Costumes?

sexy-mexican-shooter-costume

kids-poncho-costume

#3 Comment By David Dudley Field ’25 On June 10, 2019 @ 10:25 am

The implication of your post seems to be that these sorts of ‘controversies’ are unwarranted–that, presumably, Williams should be entirely blasé about such incidents.

Yes! There should never be an all-campus e-mail or “investigation” about anything that any student ever wears.

Now, of course, I have no complaint if Dean Sandstrom, or any member of the Williams faculty, were to privately reach out to any student (on any topic!) and give them some useful life advice.

Like maybe you don’t want to dress like that!

#4 Comment By Whitney Wilson ’90 On June 10, 2019 @ 10:28 am

These issues are complicated and sensitive. Everyone needs to think about how they act and react. Otherwise, nobody wins but the lawyers.

I don’t know enough about the background and facts of this story to be able to comment substantively, but from what is laid out in the Washington Post article, it could easily have happened in Williamstown. Here is the key summary, but its worth reading the entire article:

On Nov. 9, 2016, the day after Donald Trump clinched the presidency, a student at Oberlin College entered a local bakery and convenience store, hoping to leave with a few bottles of wine.

Instead, Jonathan Aladin, 19, ran from the store, chased by an employee, Allyn D. Gibson. A brawl broke up between the two men — the young black student, a sophomore at the time, and the white businessman — which turned into a standoff between the liberal arts college and the downtown establishment, a proxy war in a larger struggle over free speech, racial sensitivity and town-gown relations.

The skirmish came with a price tag for the college of $11 million, the sum awarded on Friday to the business by a jury in Lorain County, Ohio. The judgment, which found the college responsible for libel and infliction of emotional distress, provided a bookend to the bitter conflict, which has divided the Oberlin community, nestled 35 miles from Cleveland.

#5 Comment By fendertweed On June 10, 2019 @ 10:39 am

Rather appalling IMO to hear a veteran (military) toss out “torture” so cavalierly in this context.

One would think the author has more respect for his own history and what his comrades and predecessors endured.

Sad.

#6 Comment By John Drew On June 10, 2019 @ 11:02 am

I’m glad that Darel Paul mentions view point discrimination. It would be useful for Williams to start collecting data to measure the amount of political bias on campus. I’m confident it is far worse than any other form of bias.

As Paul points out, at the University of Michigan, “…a 2016 campus climate survey conducted by the university found that self-reported discrimination on the basis of political orientation was more prevalent than on the basis of either race or sex. The university does not even collect incident data on experiences of political bias.”

If there were no institutionalized bias against conservatives at Williams College, we should expect at least 30% of the faculty would be conservatives. Right now it appears to be about 1%.

#7 Comment By Abl On June 10, 2019 @ 1:32 pm

David- I don’t understand what point you’re trying to make by posting those costumes. Are you implying that the taco six costumes were not offensive because similar outfits are available for purchase? There are all sorts of items available for purchase that I think you and I would agree are offensive, problematic, or otherwise un-ideal.

In any event, you didn’t answer my question. We can agree regarding the prudence of amplifying a problem that should be dealt with privately, or of publicly shaming students, and yet disagree
regarding whether the underlying conduct was problematic. Do you or do you not see the problem with dressing up as an exaggerated negative-stereotype-reinforcing caricature of Mexican people?

#8 Comment By Dal On June 10, 2019 @ 3:41 pm

It’s not a negative stereotype. If you think it is, you are the one who has a problem with historic Mexican apparel. It’s actually quite beautiful.

#9 Comment By abl On June 10, 2019 @ 3:52 pm

It’s not a negative stereotype. If you think it is, you are the one who has a problem with historic Mexican apparel. It’s actually quite beautiful.

B.S.

The point of dressing up in one of these costumes isn’t to recognize the beauty in Mexican textiles; it’s to laugh at them. Students, for the most part, wear costumes like this because they think it’s funny. To the extent there can be any confusion about this fact, the jokey nature of these costumes is made obvious by the mustaches (worn by men and women alike), the fake gun or the accompanying tequila shot glass, and by the expressions and poses that students adopt while wearing these outfits.

Putting aside the fundamental issues with wearing an oppressed culture as a costume, Halloween on college campuses isn’t a time for expressing reverence or respect. It’s an opportunity to dress up in some sort of sexy or ridiculous fashion and party. There are certainly ways for non-Mexican students to express their admiration for Mexican culture. Dressing up as an inauthentic stereotype for laughs is not one of them.

#10 Comment By John Drew On June 10, 2019 @ 4:15 pm

I don’t think it is plausible to say that Mexicans are oppressed at Williams College.

As the April 9 anti-white rant indicated, white students are the folks on campus most subject to the most vicious forms of humiliation, ridicule and abuse. It is silly to complain about costumes when there are much more serious bias incidents on campus targeted at pro-life, white, Jewish, male or conservative students.

As Paul has noted elsewhere, the dean of the faculty went out of her way to say the school will be better off when it is less white and less male.

It seems like we should be focusing the view point discrimination Paul mentions before we turn to fix what appear to be less urgent, perhaps even non-existent problems.

#11 Comment By dragline On June 11, 2019 @ 3:12 am

I believe there are bigger fish to fry at Williams college. Here’s a first question: Why is Williams College unique among ANY comparable schools in Massachusetts in that it has no “sworn” security guards, i.e. they are ALL rent-a-cops with no legal authority. Out of over 100+ colleges in MA, only 20% fit that profile. Out of that 20%, almost all are day-school community colleges or small religious schools. There exists not a single school comparable to Williams that takes such an indifferent attitude toward security. By rule and by process, all criminal complaints are funneled through the WPD. All of which is completely off limits to the MSP.

I am a Williams Alum and I would not send my daughter there for all the whiskey in Ireland.

#12 Comment By Dragline On June 11, 2019 @ 3:27 am

This whole thread is loco.

How about focusing on more substantial issues, like the fact that Williams College, with a endowment now approaching $3 billion, does not employ “sworn” security guards, i.e. those empowered to make arrests and uphold the laws of the Commonwealth.

Go ahead and peruse the UCR and NIBRS data available through the FBI and you will see that Williams is entirely unique among its peers. It stands alone in its refusal to hire sworn, professional security guards to protect its students. And make no mistake, the kids suffer for it. Why? Because sworn security guards would make it that much easier for ugly incidents to see the light of day – providing justice for victims but perhaps dinging Williams’ endowment in the process.

This school is a cesspool and anyone willing to send their daughter there is insane.

#13 Comment By Dragline On June 11, 2019 @ 3:40 am

This is in response to all #9.

“Inauthentic stereotype”

Have you ever been to Mexico???

Please stop fomenting outrage based upon your own ignorance.

#14 Comment By fendertweed On June 11, 2019 @ 9:32 am

Dragline,

What specifically is your concern?

What’s not being done that should?
What’s being done that should not be?

I spent 25 yrs in & around law enforcement and am trying to figure out your specific concerns other than a general observation.

#15 Comment By fendertweed On June 11, 2019 @ 9:46 am

… part of my point is based on what I perceive as the over-criminalization of some conduct (and I was prosecution/investigative side fo years.

If the concern is spiking incidents that’s understandable.

#16 Comment By 0xEph On June 11, 2019 @ 10:01 am

This is in response to all #9.

“Inauthentic stereotype”

Have you ever been to Mexico???

Please stop fomenting outrage based upon your own ignorance.

lololololololololololololol

No, you are correct. The students in that picture capture Mexicans perfectly.

#17 Comment By John Drew On June 11, 2019 @ 12:31 pm

@dragline

I am a Williams Alum and I would not send my daughter there for all the whiskey in Ireland.

Your comment on the lax administration of justice at Williams College reminds me of a recent case in which a black student was caught selling drugs to kids at the local high school. According to the leftist student activists, it was racist to punish this drug dealing student for poisoning the local high school kids.

By the time the left is done, it will be considered cruel to put criminals in jail and educational to put good people in jail.

#18 Comment By Dragline On June 13, 2019 @ 3:52 am

OxEph:

Nice switching of terms. I do not recall saying the kids’ costumes “capture Mexicans perfectly.” That is you own delusion. What I said is that they are not “inauthentic.” Mariachi bands playing street music, dressed like this, are ubiquitous in Mexico. So the kids dressed in the costumes- of people very different than they are. For fun. For the incongruity, and yes the laughs. Which is the end goal of most every costume wearer.

Ascribing their motivation to wanting to laugh at / denigrate Mexicans is a case of you seeing what you want to see.

#19 Comment By 0xEph On June 13, 2019 @ 10:17 am

Dragline,

I think it’s pretty clear from the context that I’m not switching terms to win an argument. To the extent you were confused about that, let me be crystal clear: the Williams students here are participating in a highly inauthentic mockery of Mexican dress. The fact that you seem to think these outfits are authentic replicas of what Mariacha bands wear is an offense akin to “all black people look alike to me”: these are no more than the roughest approximation of one small subset of Mexican clothing (a subset that is itself a nonrepresentative stereotype of what Mexicans look like).

I get that this is “for fun . . . and yes the laughs.” That’s the whole problem here. And that’s a big reason why it’s probably not a good idea to dress up as any oppressed minority for Halloween. I would have similar problems if the students were wearing fake noses, exaggerated yarmulkes, and sheets to mimic tallit — or if they were in blackface.

abl put it well:

The point of dressing up in one of these costumes isn’t to recognize the beauty in Mexican textiles; it’s to laugh at them. Students, for the most part, wear costumes like this because they think it’s funny. To the extent there can be any confusion about this fact, the jokey nature of these costumes is made obvious by the mustaches (worn by men and women alike), the fake gun or the accompanying tequila shot glass, and by the expressions and poses that students adopt while wearing these outfits.

Putting aside the fundamental issues with wearing an oppressed culture as a costume, Halloween on college campuses isn’t a time for expressing reverence or respect. It’s an opportunity to dress up in some sort of sexy or ridiculous fashion and party. There are certainly ways for non-Mexican students to express their admiration for Mexican culture. Dressing up as an inauthentic stereotype for laughs is not one of them.

#20 Comment By 0xEph On June 13, 2019 @ 10:23 am

You seem to think that this is ok because students are dressing up like this ‘in good fun.’ But it’s not good fun if it upsets people of Latinx origin (and these specific costumes very much did). If a group of non-Jewish students dressed up as Jewish stereotypes for Halloween and a large proportion of Jewish students on campus were upset, I think you’d understand the problem — and this is much more akin to if the German Student Alliance collectively went as inauthentic caricatures of Jews for Halloween because, in their eyes, ‘Jews look funny / dress funny.’

#21 Comment By anon On June 13, 2019 @ 2:22 pm

Oh brother-

Except that it does not “upset people who are from Mexico” in this case- or people from latin origin generally. That is why the stores are full of this kind of cultural wear if you go down South. The vast majority of latin American people do not care about this.

Your point seems to be- that if one single person takes offense, or if such a device is ever used offensively- then it must be banned.

Ridiculous. Eventually we will all be naked. No one will wear green on St Patricks day… etc. etc.

This is about what very few white people and others not from latin origin say latin people should care about- not what people from latin heritage actually care about.

It is an invented offense. Much like the peace symbol now is- as now supposedly a symbol (solely) of white supremacy. Or Gadsden flag.

This is faux offense.

#22 Comment By 0xEph On June 13, 2019 @ 3:48 pm

Except that it does not “upset people who are from Mexico” in this case- or people from latin origin generally. That is why the stores are full of this kind of cultural wear if you go down South. The vast majority of latin American people do not care about this.

I’d be very careful about generalizing, especially regarding a population about which you know little. There are many, many, many people from Mexico or of Mexican descent who are upset by these types of things. And there were many, many, many people from Mexico and of Mexican descent who were upset by the specific student costumes above.

That is why the stores are full of this kind of cultural wear if you go down South. The vast majority of latin American people do not care about this.

No! Obviously no!

Is the fact that you can buy many (more) confederate flag items “down South” an indication that the confederate flag must not upset any Americans who were descended from slaves? You’re presumably sufficiently intelligent and perceptive to understand that that’s not the case. Because, in large part, of people like you — who don’t care if others are offended by their ‘good fun’ (or who justify their behaviors on the fiction that somehow, despite a loud cry for them to stop, that nobody is offended) — there are lots of things that are sold and trafficked and worn in society despite the fact that they are deeply hurtful. I don’t want to draw equivalencies between the hurtfulness and harm inflicted by an inauthentic stereotypical costume worn for the sake of laughing at members of an oppressed culture and the hurtfulness and harm inflicted by the symbol of rebellion and slavery. My point is simply that the availability of something for purchase is far from an indication of its anodyne nature.

Your point seems to be- that if one single person takes offense, or if such a device is ever used offensively- then it must be banned.

No. I wrote: “But it’s not good fun if it upsets people of Latinx origin (and these specific costumes very much did).” Note the plural. I also didn’t say that it’s never ok to dress up in traditional Mexican outfits, or that anything specifically should be “banned.” You’re importing your own exaggerated ideas of what a leftist argument looks like on to what I am actually saying. That said, as a general rule, part of being a good person is considering how your actions will affect others. If I knew that there was a single student at Williams who was the son of a celebrity involved in an embarrassing scandal who was sensitive about that scandal, I would think twice before wearing a halloween costume that rubbed salt on that wound (irrespective of whether I believe that I would have been similarly sensitive in that circumstance).

This is about what very few white people and others not from latin origin say latin people should care about- not what people from latin heritage actually care about.

I know this is the direction that a lot of right-wing responses to the social justice left have taken, but it’s a lie that’s easily uncovered. If you were at Williams at the time, or even remotely connected with the social justice left, you would understand that the overwhelmingly majority (and yes, there are occasional exceptions!) of these sorts of pushes not only include numerous members of the impacted community, but are usually primarily driven by members of said community. If a group of many Latinx individuals says “this behavior is hurtful and harmful to the Latinx community,” it’s almost always the case that the behavior in question is hurtful and harmful to the Latinx community.

For the record, I haven’t seen much that indicates that the ‘ok’ symbol is being used as a symbol of white supremacy (I assume that’s what you meant: I haven’t ever even heard of the peace symbol being an alleged issue). I also haven’t seen any particularly significant push in the social justice community to stop people from using the ‘ok’ symbol (or the peace symbol for that matter). To the contrary, the hullabaloo around the ‘ok’ symbol mostly seems to consist of right wing talking heads amplifying the occasional exception to this (presumably to imply that all such expressions of “this is offensive” must be similarly empty). Ironically, at least as it currently stands, I think we can agree that the ‘ok’ symbol is somewhat of a “faux offense” — although one created much more by the right than the left.

#23 Comment By abl On June 13, 2019 @ 11:34 pm

David – there’s comment from 0xEph in this thread that looks like it got stuck in the spam filter. I’m not sure how to resuscitate it.

Also, would it be possible to write these threads without reposting the photos of the students?

#24 Comment By David Dudley Field ’25 On June 14, 2019 @ 8:54 am

> without reposting the photos

Why? None of have asked me not to. It is impossible to discuss how “offensive” the costumes are without seeing them.

> there’s comment from 0xEph

Fixed. Thanks for pointing that out!

#25 Comment By Anon On June 14, 2019 @ 10:08 am

I have spent years in Central and South America working with the people who live there. I speak Spanish. I have an solid understanding of the customs and traditions. I was given this same dress by a group I worked with from Mexico.

This is not the same thing as a Confederate flag. But hey, we can attempt to try and conflate all kinds of really bad symbols with the innocuous depiction above to try to make a point that does not exist.

You assume I know very little about a population which in fact I have long duration of intimate exposure with. You also assume I am right wing- which I am not.

So yes, I know what I am talking about. Most people from Latin America do not care about this. The vast majority are busy working real problems, rather than worrying about whether or not an affluent college kid wears a sombrero on cinco de mayo.

This is a silly conversation. I have other things to do, so I am going to have to leave you for the fretting on this one.

Adios.

#26 Comment By 0xEph On June 14, 2019 @ 12:22 pm

I have spent years in Central and South America working with the people who live there. I speak Spanish. I have an solid understanding of the customs and traditions.

Color me skeptical that you’ve had these sorts of conversations. It’s difficult to imagine how this would arise in Nicaragua, for example. In any event, this may just point to the fact that (gasp!) Latinx people are not monolithic in their beliefs. What is upsetting to a Costa Rican living in Costa Rica may well be very different to what is upsetting to a person of Mexican ancestry living in Texas. Nevertheless, I do believe that there are many Latinx people who don’t care about this (or who care but think there are bigger things to worry about). But the undisputable fact of the matter is that there are many Latinx people both in the Williams community and out who find the above upsetting.

I was given this same dress by a group I worked with from Mexico.

The fact that you continue to describe the above student outfits as the “same” is a pretty clear indication that, despite whatever time you’ve spent in Central and South America, you have a pretty poor understanding of the culture. Traditional Mexican dress is not the same throughout Mexico, let alone as traditional Nicaraguan dress, traditional Brazilian dress, etc. And none of them are the “same” as what the students wore above.

This is not the same thing as a Confederate flag. But hey, we can attempt to try and conflate all kinds of really bad symbols with the innocuous depiction above to try to make a point that does not exist.

Way to blatantly mischaracterize my point, which I spelled out for you: “My point is simply that the availability of something for purchase is far from an indication of its anodyne nature.”

In any event, I think we can both agree that there are more important issues right now than what a group of Williams students wore for Halloween years ago.

#27 Comment By anon On June 14, 2019 @ 2:34 pm

Ok, I’ll respond. Pa decir “!por supuesto!”

It was a joke. Myself and the Mexican officials I was working with at the time were at my house after a training event- for a two month block of education and training that I was in charge of. They brought me these “same” kinds of outfits.

Yes, myself and the officials I was working with are well aware that there are various types of dress in Mexico.. and throughout Latin America. I have spent over a decade down south in my adult life. Although this event occurred in the United States- they came here for training.

The point is that the regular people of Mexico, including the higher ranking officials I was training, know of this kind of cultural appropriation and find it amusing.

But I get it, some kids at the elite college are offended, so the dean must take action.

You are correct that we have better things to worry about than college kids in costumes. We agree.

#28 Comment By anon On June 14, 2019 @ 3:01 pm

To add, my depth of knowledge of the continent is broad. It involves work from TJ to Tierra Del Fuego. And not just in capital cities and costal resort towns. A lot of work in small villages all along the Amazon and its tributaries.

I have worked with local people down south in over a dozen nations. I have time down south sleeping in five star hotels, resort villas, as well as living in the jungle using a poncho and hammock for long periods of time.

so I have a pretty good grasp of the culture.

#29 Comment By 0xEph On June 14, 2019 @ 3:56 pm

so I have a pretty good grasp of the culture.

And yet you are fully incorrect when you try to speak for all Latinx people. A large number of Latinx people across a wide range of income and educational levels–a population that far exceeds “some kids at the elite college”–find these sorts of practices hurtful. The only way to arrive at any other conclusion would be to deliberately blind yourself to the truth of most these controversies. It may be impossible to determine if this number constitutes an overwhelming majority, most, or just many. But I’m not sure it matters.

I don’t know about you, but there are many behaviors that I avoid or conversations that I treat delicately because the cost to me of not hurting other’s feelings is low, especially compared with the crappiness of hurt feelings. That is true irrespective of whether the behaviors or conversations in question hurt my feelings, or whether I can intellectualize the hurt in question. As a society, we generally refer this as “politeness” or “decency.”

I get it: you don’t think that people’s feelings should be hurt by costumes like this. I personally don’t think that people’s feelings should be hurt by most conduct that society deems impolite, so I’m empathetic to the position you’re in. But I don’t understand why the result of your disagreement with the hurt results in a “let’s do it anyway!” position. Maybe you’re the sort of person who generally goes around hurting the feelings of others. I doubt it, though: most people who fall into the “let’s not get upset about arguably offensive costumes” boat tend to be fairly sensitive individuals in other contexts, including toward individuals who are sensitive about things that they are not. Why can’t we just treat these sorts of issues likewise?

I’m sorry our conversation got somewhat heated, because you sound like an at least somewhat thoughtful person. If we both agree that this is a relatively small deal, can we also agree that avoiding wearing these costumes is a relatively small concession to make?

#30 Comment By GloryDaysChaser On June 15, 2019 @ 8:11 pm

I see that JCD is now allowed to take cheap shots in posts and then close off all comments. I love how the right-wing case for free speech continues to undermine itself at Ephblog.